Price Anchoring and Deal Killers: Jerry Green's Secret Weapons

Brandon: "Hello and welcome back to another episode of the Collective Clicks podcast. This is your host, Brandon Bateman, and today I'm joined by Jerry Green. Jerry is a sales wizard. We talk a ton about the strategies that are working for him and the students in the sales space. I think you'll get a lot of value from this episode. I'll see you there. Jerry, how are you doing today?"

Jerry: "Hey, what's up, Brandon? I'm doing well. Yeah, I'm excited to talk to you. This episode has been a long time in the coming, with the years that we've known each other. It's definitely about time to do this."

Brandon: "Yeah, I totally agree with you. It has been a long time coming. We talked and talked about that, so I'm excited to jump on here with you and try to share a little bit here. So, you know, I got a couple of years behind me, so hopefully, I can share some knowledge."

Jerry: "Yeah, it's to give people a little window into what we were talking about, literally just before we started here. I was telling Jerry, like, I mean, we've talked about sales here and there a little bit. I've been meaning to just suck all the information out of your brain for a while now. It's cool to have that opportunity to do that in the public setting, where, you know, everybody can benefit from what you have to say. So, before we get too deep, for anybody that doesn't know about the famous Jerry Green, who are you, where do you come from, what do you do?"

Jerry: "Well, that's a deep question. You can go as deep or as shallow as you want. The answer could be Ohio, and I do sales training. You can, uh, can well, you know, I'll rant. You know, just kind of sharing with you and, you know, all the viewers, and look, guys, I, my name is Jerry Green, and I'm actually from Ohio, and I was raised over in Springfield, Ohio, and currently live in Germantown, Ohio right now. And that's about an hour from my original birthplace there in Springfield, Ohio. I currently live there in Germantown, with my wife, and we have five kids now. My kids are, a lot of them have grown now, so, you know, it's, they're starting to kind of go out there a little bit on things, but one got married last year. We actually still have four at home, so, uh, so it's, yeah, so there's a lot of going on there, but, you know, they're doing a lot of cool things. The boys are getting involved in the business, and so, you know, great family, love that, and, you know, that's, that's all wonderful. Now, on the business side of things, Brandon, you know, I got started in this business back in 1994, so this is actually year 30, which is hard to believe, man. Want to know when I was born?"

Brandon: "Jerry, I get this a lot. What, '90, '94, '96?"

Jerry: "So, '96, yeah. I was learning how to use the potty when you were learning how to do real estate. So, yeah, so I started in this in 1994, and the way I got started in it was interesting, Brandon. I actually was, prior to being in this business, I was actually in an electrical contracting business with my father over in Springfield, Ohio, and I was working in that business, and then we had a large general contractor close his doors on us, and we couldn't recover from that. We ended up going bankrupt, and I was trying to figure out what to do, checking out maybe going in, you know, getting a job somewhere, and then next thing I know, I saw this advertisement on TV about an upcoming real estate seminar in Cincinnati, Ohio. Now, you got to remember, back then, we didn't have the cell phones, right? We didn't have any of that to, you know, have ads pop up or anything like that, so it was either on TV or the newspaper. And I said, man, I'm going to go check this out. And the gentleman I went to see, his organization was, uh, Charles Givens' organization, and I would say probably 90-some percent of our viewers here have no idea who that is. So, he's since passed, but he had built out, he was one of the granddaddies that really got this all started, kind of along the lines like Robert Allen and stuff like that. He was one of the ones that really built this out, the whole real estate investing side, training, and everything. And I went to that seminar, man, and ran in and sat there for three days, listening to him tell me about all these different strategies. One in particular stuck out to me, and one of the things they talked about was, and back then, they used a little bit different terminology, but they talked about retailing, retailing meaning flips, and then they also talked about wholesaling, okay, but wholesaling back then, nobody knew anything about it, nobody. Yeah, so I decided that's what I wanted to do. I came back, started applying things on it, and literally, I had to educate the attorneys, I had to educate everybody, and they had no idea what I was doing. None. So, I basically just tell them, show up to the closing, whatever, and this is what needs to be done, and, you know what, interesting too, to Brandon, on this is, back then, a lot of the ways I was paid, my assignment fee, I was paid my assignment fee the day I assigned the contract, not at closing, okay. About nice, yeah, yeah, it worked out really well on things. So, we would just check the title and then we would just assign the paperwork, and they would take and finish it, so, and we were done with it."

Brandon: "Yeah, so that's, it's interesting how things have changed over time, but that's how I got started in it. And then I went from there, I went into the Fix and Flip model, I started building out a pretty massive machine of doing renovations, really grew that up. We went into doing some multi-family, I started getting involved with some Family Dollar stores, General Dollar Stores. We've done, we actually had our own TurnKey rental company for a while. That was miserable, so I hated that. And so, we, I've done a little bit of everything over the years on that, and, you know, what was interesting was, I built this up to the point where I had this pretty big massive machine going on that Fix and Flip side, and one day, I realized I just really hated it, and I said, I'm just going to change all that, and I pretty well cleaned house and just kind of rebuilt over again. So, that's been over 30 years. You know, some other things happened too. Early in the early 2000s, my wife and I built the business up, and she got sick at the same time we found out we were having a baby, and the day he was born, we found out my first wife had cancer, that same day. And, and we fought, and fought, it was unbelievable. We just built a brand-new home, I ended up moving out of my home, I ended up living in the Ronald McDonald House over in Columbus, because even though she was an adult, it was a childhood cancer in her kidneys, and I ended up living in Ronald McDonald House for four months straight. And so we went, we went through a lot, we ended up battling through that, got her home, and then the cancer reoccurred, and she passed away 10 months after my baby boy was born. And so I was, you know, a widowed father, and, you know, she had worked with me in the business, and we went to high school together, and all this. So, you know, it's, it's crazy, Brandon. I look at that, it's like a whole another life. I built that up, and then next you know, that happened, and it took me about two years to get really functioning again. And I mean, fortunately, I had real estate that I had built up that kept me afloat, but then I had to rebuild all that, and that's why I went really heavy into the rehab side, and, but then after a while, you know, after many years of doing that, I, I, uh, I did end up getting remarried to my wife now, Joyce, and she had kids, I had kids, and then we had one together, and next thing I know, I had the Brady Bunch. Do you remember, do you know what the Brady Bunch is, Brandon?"

Brandon: "Only because I've heard Noah talk about it because also in your generation."

Jerry: "So, so that means he's old, right?"

Brandon: "Yeah, that's right, that's right, that's, I said in your generation to be kind."

Jerry: "I love that. Yeah, so, yeah, so that's how I got built, built this up, and then what I realized too, Brandon, was over the years, you know, I just kind of continued to develop this, and what's interesting is, you know, a couple of big things I really focus on is overall systems and operations in the business, and I

realized that one of the most scalable models, I'm not saying it's the model for everyone, is, we moved, we actually, after all what we went through through, we kind of navigated back towards more of the wholesale, wholetail model, and then, of course, we've added, you know, innovations and stuff like that, but that's kind of the model we went back to more on the real estate side. And the biggest reason was, just kind of give you guys a little quick tip here on things, is something I studied with Brian Tracy. You're probably familiar with Brian Tracy, Brandon, are you?"

Brandon: "I'm not, no."

Jerry: "Oh, you're not. Yeah, you got to check out his stuff, man. Okay, Brian's been around for over 40 years, teaching people in business and mindset, and just personal development. And one of the things Brian always talked about was what we call the law of complexity, and he says that most people start a business, and they build it on a high level of complexity, and that's like the government, anything with the government, very high level of complexity. So what he said on that was, you know, look at businesses you can build with low levels of complexity, and I realized that rehabbing, there's nothing wrong with it, but it was a high level of complexity. So I decided to make a change on that, and we streamlined it and created more of a production process. So, and that's what we've done. And now what I realized within that, Brandon, too, was that if you look at this, and you think about our business that we do in the real estate space, regardless of your fix and flipping, buying and hold, or wholesaling, whatever it is, it is a production line, and you have boxes for each position, don't you? And just like in your business, and what we have to do is we have to take that one box, and we have to really work on that. And one of the things that I realized was a key to all this was Acquisitions, right? That skill of how to convert on a high level and what I, 100 percent, because I always say this, look, without Acquisitions, nothing happens. And here's the, so, so if I play Devil's Advocate, you could say that about a lot of things, but here, here's the difference, if you really look at this business, it's not just, it's not the only thing that you can't Outsource in the business is Acquisitions. Marketing has to happen, right? Without marketing, nothing happens, but you can hire vendors, you can buy leads, like, whatever, there's different ways to get that done. There's no way to Outsource your Acquisitions. In your comp, you can even Outsource dispositions, but Acquisitions, that's like the, that's the bread and butter, right? It's the one thing."

Jerry: "It is, it is. And what I learned on this, too, bringing in, though, was, you know, when I first started in this, I went out on appointment for years and years on my own. Back then, it wasn't even really thought of, anybody else doing it but you, so, you know, and I've done it, and for over, for over 10 years, I've done it, all that myself. Over 10, it was probably closer to 15 years. I just went on appointment after appointment after appointment, and, you know, in the beginning, I came across like most of the gurus would teach you back then, you know, just go in, hey, you know, if I could pay y'all cash, close quickly, this is, you know, that type of thing, and it worked, but it got a lot of pushback, got a lot of Nos. And what I realized after a little bit of time, I started studying more and more, that it wasn't about going in and being hardcore, trying to make somebody an offer. What it was about was solving problems, solving problems. And then I realized something after many years of doing this, that, and this is a good little golden nugget for all of you guys, sales is not about selling. Sales is about assisting somebody in a decision-making process. So what you really want to do is focus on how you can navigate somebody through that decision process that they're going to make regardless. You just got to get good at navigating them through that process, so they work with you."

Brandon: "Yeah, yeah, it's fascinating. I'm 100 percent with you. One thing I told my sales team before is, you know, when you've done your job really well, when close to the end of the call, the person asks you for your opinion on if they should hire you or not."

Jerry: "100 percent, because they don't put it in the position of like, of course, they're going to say yes. They know that you're on their side of trying to figure it out. And you actually have to be genuine to that, too. You know, like, if you talk to, like, in any situation, like, if you're not the best solution for somebody, but you should be upfront about that, and then also do everything you can to make yourself the best solution for as many people as you can. But that's, yeah, that's super insightful, although, and I'm sure you have a fantastic answer to this, I think I think a lot of people would agree with what you just said. I don't think a lot of people would say no, Jerry, that's not true. I think where it gets really hard is actually fulfilling on that promise, and 100 percent, that's especially hard when you know you're training a team, for example, and all those things, because what you just described is a heck of a lot harder than going into the house and saying, you know, what, I'm going to get you cash in this amount of time. I'm going to pay you more than somebody else, and whatever, right? That very transaction form of sales we just talked about is so much harder. How do you train somebody to actually do that, because that's a high-level skill?"

Jerry: "Yeah, well, I think, first of all, I think we have to start from the big myth that we hear. I hear this a lot from a lot of people I work with and in the industry in general. This common thing people say, I need that Rockstar sales pro. Okay, guys, that really doesn't exist. What you have to focus on is a rockstar sales process that an average person can follow that has the proper drive, that has the, what I call, Big Money energy, and has, you know, overall, the right attitude on things. If you have that person, I can take somebody that's delivering pizzas, and in 90 days, have them closing on a high level. It's about the process. It's about the process, and it doesn't matter if you're an extrovert, introvert, it doesn't matter when it comes to that, you guys. That's the big thing that people have to think about, and some of your listeners, the guys when you're listening to this, you might be building out some of your teams and stuff like that, and you're hunting for that salesperson, that perfect salesperson. Stop doing that. Focus on the sales process side, and obviously, you're going to bring the right person in, but you don't, they don't have, you know, people are trying to bring the salesperson they, hey, they sold cars and stuff, guys, this is a whole different ball game. And I think, Brandon, that's, that's another big thing that we see all the time, too, is people, and, and I just, personal experience, my own team, anybody that I've ever hired before on our sales team that has had a lot of sales experience, is usually the ones that I end up firing."

Brandon: "Okay, yeah, that's, I have a hypothesis. I want you to tell me if this is true. My hypothesis is that often times, the companies that are the best in the world at a particular thing, they can't hire experienced people. I've seen it happen with digital marketing. We specifically usually try not to hire really experienced digital marketers, because all that means to me is that you've been tainted by the standards that other people have with this industry, and our standards are different, and I'm going to spend two years trying to jam into your head that what you did before isn't good enough, or I could find somebody who's fresh out of college, doesn't know a thing about what's expected of them anywhere, and convince them that our extremely high standards are normal."

Jerry: "And exactly, Brandon, I, dude, I totally agree with you on this. I've seen salesperson after salesperson come in, and I just realized that I, I, I just kind of shy away from that anymore because a lot of them come in, they go, oh, I know, I, I'm really good at selling. Me, then all of a sudden, we expose them to an actual sales process, and they go, well, this is, I, I, I know this. I know this, but then what happens is, they go in, they don't follow the process, they don't use the tools, okay, and then they see their results tank, and then somebody else that doesn't have any of that past history comes in, say, I'm just going to follow exactly what you're training me on,

Jerry. I'm going to apply that, and not only am I gonna apply that, I'm gonna do self-study. That's, people that sell, that's what you want, y, yep, someone nice and hungry."

Brandon: "Yeah, total Game Changer, bro. Yeah, one of, yeah, one of my, just to give an example, like, one of my, one of my best salespeople, he shows up to his first day of the job, and he's already really, really good, and we can't figure out why. We come to find out he listened to every single episode of this podcast. At the time, there were more than 50 of them. He listened to every single episode of that podcast before he showed up to work for his first day because he wanted to learn the industry and understand what he was selling, and then he just mirrored all the things that he heard there about what we talk about digital marketing. Like, that go great because he's hungry, right? And he's willing to like put in those, although I want to challenge you on something, this challenge isn't for me, but let me just tell you about a conversation I had with somebody earlier today, and I'm curious what you would say about it. So, so I was talking to this person, somebody that we, that we both know, although I, I don't know that he would want me to share, share what he said. I'll just leave out the name, just, just, just in case. So, he had recently acquired a company, and, and we were just talking about like how's that going, and he talked about how, like, you know, it's, it's a little bit of a mess in the sales team, and we're trying to figure some of that stuff out, and I asked him, what do you learned from it? He said, well, the thing I learned that I've always kind of known is that salespeople, great salespeople, aren't created, they're born. And I have never found a way to train a salesperson. They're just, they're good, or they're not, is what he said. He then, so, and so, so I have two questions for you. Number one, to what extent is that compatible or not with what you're saying? Maybe that's true, and what you're saying is true, or maybe you disagree, and then, and then number two, um, if you do disagree, what then, why has that been his experience, and, and why, for anybody who's listening to this, that maybe feels that way, or has had a similar experience, what could they be missing? What is it they, that they should understand that they don't understand, would change their perspective?"

Jerry: "Yeah, I mean, great question. I, I guess, you know, first part of that, is that I, I believe that people do have to have some of that DNA in them, okay, so it's not, you know, I, I look at that, they got have some of that DNA, but it's not so much the sales portion of, as it is, what the drive on that, Brandon, the drive, the building, and, and here's a big component, I hit on this just briefly a few minutes ago, and a lot of people don't think about this, but a big thing is called Big Money energy, okay, because you find a lot of people in there that go into sales positions, and guess what, and sometimes people put them in those position where money really is not that important to them, and guys, those conflict, those are two conflicting values there, okay, so it's like, oh, I'm not really worried about, if I can just make whatever, I'm cool, and then you put a person in a sales, that doesn't work, yeah, okay, you're gonna have, you got to have somebody that really drives that. So I think part of that is true in regards to the, the DNA study of things, so, but, you know, it, it's, it comes down, though, to understanding that if somebody has those key components, like, say, the drive, I mean, when we look at someone to come in on our side of things, we want someone with that, basically, never give up attitude, okay, that's very consistent, that is very heavily driven, that is, u, a big, a big thing is not a whiner, okay, that is open to being in a position where they got to humble themselves, even though they maybe studied some in sales, they realize that we are basic going to retrain them completely, okay, and if you have someone like that, and just overall enjoys talking to people and things, we, you know, we find them be very successful. Now, another component to this, Brandon, that we, we actually started testing on this, in the last about a year and a half, and that is critical thinking, okay, we actually started testing people on critical thinking."

Brandon: "It was interesting, how do you do that? Sorry, to, to ask the tangential question, but how do you test?"

Jerry: "We actually create, we've actually got a whole test that we built out on that, interesting."

Brandon: "You created this yourself, or you found like some, some, like assessments?"

Jerry: "Well, I'm working with someone on this, on things, but yeah, we set this up, and it's, it's basically critical thinking, and it's interesting on this, Brandon, because what it does, it's, it's critical thinking, and we look at problem-solving, because if you look at this, and sales, what are we really doing, solving problems, okay, and the, and think about average salespeople, what do they do, average salespeople, they go in, you know, we're in our business, oh, hey, what do you, you know, what are you asking for the property, well, I can't give you that, here's what I can give you, and all this stuff here, that's, you know, that's how you get very poor and below-average results, you assume, it's, what's that, they assume it's a fixed-sum game, versus, yeah, they do, right?"

Brandon: "It's like, it's like binary, like either my price is going to work for you or it's not, rather than there being a thousand possible directions the conversation, 100 percent, yep, so what we, you know, it, it's interesting on that, because what we learned on that, was, you know, when you get somebody that's understands some of the critical thinking, some problem-solving, then you can start plugging them in, and they can take the sales process, and then they can start applying it. Now, what's cool on this, too, those are the people, too, that understand how to apply different programs with a seller, okay, so, for instance, okay, if I'm working with a seller, and let's pretend you're a seller, on things, Brandon, I might be running through things, and I'll say, you know, Brandon, wow, you know, Brandon, I'm so sorry, based upon what you're telling me, it doesn't sound like your property is going to qualify for our cash-out program, but, you know, Brandon, I do have another program that I can probably get you some more money on, but I, I'm just not sure if that's something you're even interested in hearing anything about, okay, so you notice I just took, took away, and then I opened in, I, I laid the door out, but they were the ones that are going to say, yeah, let me open that, okay, and see, critical thinkers, problem solvers, will apply that."

Brandon: "Yeah, that, that, that makes, that makes a ton of sense. Oh, man, you talked about so many things, so you're basically talking about like, they're hungry, they're humble, they're able to think critically, which, I don't even know what that correlates with, is that an intelligence thing, or is it more of like a, like a creativity, it is, it a big part of it, bringing in, is an intelligence factor?"

Jerry: "Okay, and, and I'm, look, I say some of you might be listening to this, and I'm not, I'm not trying to slam anybody, but when you hire dumb people, it will affect your business, okay, so you've got to look at this, and that critical thinking is really important because think about this, too, Brandon, people got to understand how the good Acquisitions reps should have, have the ability to explain contracts and have people understand what process looks like going forward."

Brandon: "Brandon, okay, I mean, like for us, we take, anytime we bring somebody on, when it comes to Acquisitions, there's three components to onboarding them, three components, number one, operations. They got to understand the operational side of Acquisitions, how does it flow, what steps are involved, if you're working the CRM, what do you need to do in here, what are you supposed to say to the client of what is their next steps in the journey, right?"

Jerry: "Yeah, and then, and then we look at the next component, we look at is, obviously, sales process. Now, sales process, they have to learn foundational things before they can even get on talking the clients, but then also we do continued training every single week, and

I do that a lot by training people, uh, you know, with the sales Academy, people come in, and they all, my students across the country come in and learn from the on that, but also we do additional training every week. We're doing it, average of three times times a week on sales training, okay, and then the third component is contract execution, or what I, I like to refer to is contract presentation. So, how do they really know how to present a contract to a seller? Can they explain the tax pro rations? Okay, yeah, so, if we, we learned that onboarding those three areas has cured up a big chunk of problems for us."

Brandon: "Yeah, that's fascinating. I mean, I think that, yeah, decreases the problems that acquisition solves. I think the stereotype in a lot of companies is the salespeople cause all the problems, and everybody else is just like running around in circles trying to find a way to solve them."

Jerry: "Yeah, you can't find anybody to close deals that doesn't cause a lot of problems in the process. It's just, you know, it's a stereotypical, like, operations versus sales thing. It sounds like your solution is, if you have the right training and the right kind of people in sales, then maybe that's less of a factor."

Brandon: "Yep, 100 percent. Yeah, you know, I think about, you know, Brandon, with, with that, like the lead, you know, obviously, you're in the lead generation business here, and you know, one of the best out, out there, you know, that do an amazing job. You know, what's interesting, and I'm sure you hear this a lot, too, people get leads all the time, they say the leads aren't any good, right, or they, they, it's easy to blame the leads, is that true?"

Jerry: "Oh, 100 percent, not only do we see that across our clients, we see that in our own team, like everywhere, right, like no, yeah, it's, it's like the standard, like, the leads are week, no, you're a week kind of, well, let me share something with you, guys, on this, is it okay if I can share something with you? Okay, see, Mo, think about it, in sales, in general, okay, now this, I'm going to put it into our world, when it comes to working with sellers, but it can go, anything across the board, it can apply to, see, most people, you think about it, on our world, what's the, what's the best type of seller that we'd like, in our world, Brandon, what, what's the best one?"

Brandon: "Distress, look, motivated, distress."

Jerry: "Okay, so it's the one that has the multiple peppers, right?"

Brandon: "Yeah, that's right, we talking about our database, where we have the number, the number of Chili Peppers, pre, yes, okay, highly distressed, right, that's what we look at, but here's the thing, Brandon, on that, it's really hard to build a scalable business around those leads, only, fa point. So what happens is, most leads come in, and this is something we, we, we train people on, what we call the seller Continuum, and on the seller Continuum, leads come in, most people put people in, they say, hey, they're highly distressed, they're very motivated, great candidate, and then other people come in, in the middle, and they look at them, and they say, they're Tire kickers, right, we hear a lot of, they're Tire kickers, but I want you guys to start thinking things differently, because what we do, and what we're really good at, at training people to do, is take Tire kickers and convert them to Deals, and the reason that we're good at that, and I train people on that, is it doesn't matter, this is really important, everybody understand, it does not matter where your seller sits on the Continuum, they could be highly motivated, they could be neutral, okay, it doesn't matter where they said at, the key is, how do you figure out where they're at now, and where do they want to be, and that's done, what, with the best salespeople in the world, Brandon, on this, okay, and this is what I train people on, the best salespeople in the world understand something, and it's called The Gap, and the Gap is, for where somebody's at now, to where they want to be, and this applies, in our world, in your world, any world, when it comes to sales, when you can understand where somebody's at now, and what, what they want to be, what happens on that, is you create what we call the picture-perfect scenario, and when you can do that, it creates urgency to act, without that, it doesn't happen on things, okay, and it's, that's why most people lack at closing things on a high level, and that's why, like, a lot of our students, we work with, typically, when they apply the sales process, and they start really learning, over and over again, and build it as a skill, we will see the conversions increase 20 to 50 percent."

Brandon: "Yeah, that, that, that makes sense. I, it's always, honestly, a, a red flag to me, when, when someone, like, like, say, we're talking to a client, or, you, their salespeople, this, this would, the most common scenario here would be someone who does their own Acquisitions, which would be some of our smaller Cs, and they say, like, if they're motivated, I'll close them 100 percent of the time, it almost makes me feel like they're probably not going to close a lot of the leads because, like, the best person, like those who are best of acquisition, they look at every lead, it's almost like you're, there's a level of like delusion there, because the reality is, like, if you, if you look at, if you look at 10 leads, let's just say, let's say you're doing a highly, even the highly motivated lead channel, like PPC, for example, you're going to end up with, say, 15 leads to a contract, so if you look at every individual League, you can say, chances are, I'm not going to close this lead, then you can be right, but those who are really, really good, they just, they, they have this, like, belief, everyone, this is going to be the one that I close, because if you're, if you're like, if you really look at each one of those and say, I have a one in 15 chance of closing this, then you might close none of them, right?"

Jerry: "Exactly, it's, Brandon, it's when you start understanding like a process, and you constantly work on your skill, what happens on that, it becomes to the point where you can almost create your predictable results for this, okay, yeah, I mean, it, it becomes a, a pattern that you will see, and that's the only way that you can truly get to this point where you say, hey, this makes sense, I can just keep ramping this machine up."

Brandon: "Yeah, and, and that's really the key on this, and understanding that, is, is, is just a GameChanger because, see, it's just like, I, I'll share something else here, for you guys, too, a lot of people, what they do, in this, is, one of the techniques that I train people on, is to get the best deals ever, is stop asking price, okay, because what do we tell our clients, too, because it's a huge red f, for me, when I, when we're talking to a client, and it's like they, they are marking a lot of their reads as retail, my, my team asked the other day, like, what percentage of the, of a client's lead should be retail, as marked in the system, they said the answer is 0 percent, %, but we just put it there so we can find out who's, who well, and Brandon, you know, when you think about this, is something, guys, that, so this is, I, and I see a lot of people do it this way, they train their salespeople, and they go in, and a lot of times, they have a script, they'll go through, ask some questions, and then, then we'll go in, and they'll say, hey, you know, Brandon, what, any idea what you're asking for the property, you know, or what, what are you trying to get out of it, now, I want you to think about this, this, Brandon, this is one of the things that we teach on, is it's probably one of the most powerful things you'll ever learn, when it comes to getting the right number, and that is what we call Price anchoring, and think about this, before I talk about how we apply it, think about, anytime you've ever been to a store before, to buy something, and maybe it's, maybe it's some sneakers you want to buy, right, some cool tennis shoes, and you're going to the store, and you see this sign that says, value, 300

bucks, then it was marked down to $150, but today, or this weekend, it's $89, right, well, guys, they're doing a price anchor strategy with you on that, well, think about this, can you do the same thing with a seller, 100 percent, so, instead of what I do is, the way I train my people, and the way I train all my students, is I train them, stop asking the seller what they want for the property, what's the common thing that we hear, Brandon, whoever names the price first, what, what's the thing we've always heard, right, and that's complete BS, okay, because price anchoring works like this, here, and when it comes to sales, if I'm working with a seller, and I'm going along, and I say, hey, you know, I'm, I'm, and I know my number, think, think, when it comes to this, if I, if I ask you, Brandon, what you're wanting for the property, in today's world, everybody's a real estate expert by looking on Zillow, right, and then, Brandon, you give me a number, you just price anchored me, versus me price anchoring you, okay, makes sense, so you hold, you hold more power in the negotiation if you can draw the first number, is your, yeah, suggestion, but what we do is, we don't make it as an offer, okay, this is the, what we do, it's nothing more than a comparison, so it might sound something like this, you know, hey, Brandon, you know, based upon what you told me here today, and it just sounds like, sounds like there's quite a bit of work needs to be done on the property, and, Brandon, look, you know, me, for me to feel comfortable, and for me to know that I wouldn't lose money on this at all, you know, I would love to buy it for $150,000, and, but I know that's some, something you would never consider, and by the way, that's not my offer, so you said it without being evil in the, the seller's, act, so what I did is, I dropped it as an anchor tool, now the cool thing about it, Brandon, when you do it that way, you don't piss the seller on what, okay, because when, ing, green, I, I picture like losing trust with the seller, is it effective, often, yes, but you could boost trust with the seller because, yeah, if you're going to, if you're going to drop 150, and then come up to 200, can they really trust you, right, exactly, so, heads at, without reference, it, but I know that's something you would never take anyways, never consider, now, here's the thing, Brandon, when you do that, you just go quiet, you don't say a word, now what they'll do, there only two options that going to come out of that, one, they'll confirm that, oh, no way, I would never do that, okay, now you know, second thing, the second thing they'll do, is they'll come back and correct you, okay, and they'll say, no, I would never do that, I would at least have to have 170, well, this, imagine you were in the position where you were willing to pay up to 200 on that, okay, now 170 is on the table, yeah, so, and now if you come up more on that, then you look like a winner, okay, on this, you're helping them out, and then they start thanking you, so, guys, the price anchor tool, I, I always think about one gentleman that recently joined in at my Academy, he's like 70 years old, Brandon, okay, amazing guy, that's funny, and he is, he's just out there cranking it up, and he goes, Terry says, he say, I love the sales process, I love the sales process, and, you know, and he's in, he's in Pennsylvania, and, you know, and he's getting spreads in Pennsylvania of over 20 grand on some assignments, so."

Brandon: "Yeah, that's, that's fantastic. I do have one more question. I'm really curious to hear from you. So, so a lot of this, I mean, you've been doing this for 30 years, right. What I'm curious to know is, let's just say, you look at, from a sales standpoint, you look at Jerry Green from two, three years ago, and you look at what he was doing. I imagine a lot of what we talked about, Jerry Green two or three years ago knew that stuff. What have you learned recently, like, what, what is it that that you're continually learning now that you feel like is really leveling up the game when it comes to sales, yeah, Branch out if you want to, yeah, to you, like, I want, because the thing is, our most recent lessons we learned are always the most potent, they're always the most impactful to us, and I want to give you like, and I know you're talking now about like the basics of sale, but I want to give license to talk about like what's meaningful to you recently, not just what works."

Jerry: "Yeah, I think, you know, when it comes to the sales side, I think one thing that is really, that I, I, I have, I went in deeper and deeper on the study of the psychology of the sale, and how powerful that is, Brandon, and what I'm talking about is like even down to the neuroscience, neuroeconomics, and all this, and how you don't have to be a brainiac, all you have to do is pick up some of these tools, and literally, by applying certain tools, you can change your game, and I think over the last two or three years, I've seen that, to me, come out more and more, of these little tweaks that people can make, okay, for instance, like deal killers, we talk about deal killers in our training, and how to go over those, before you even talk about any numbers whatsoever at all, but we went in and done a study on this, uh, Brandon, and we realized that people, on average, most people skip the deal Killers because they don't feel like they need to talk about them, so they deal with them as objections after they talk numbers. So what we did was went in and found out that people that apply our process, before that, what we started finding now, just in one area of the sales process, just in Deal Killers, we saw an average increase of conversions between 15 to 20 percent, so imagine you making a 100 offers a year, and you can increase that by 15 to 20 percent in regards to conversion, that goes straight to the bottom line, 100 per. so that's where I really studied and started, for me, opening up on the personal basis, on things too, you know, it's kind of sharing with that a little bit, I think I, I, you know, I obviously, getting older, and I just, I, as I go forward more and more into this, I just realize, number one, goes back to the same thing, you know, time, just how important the time aspect of things is, you know, because, you know, kids are all growing up, things are changing, developing, it just goes so fast, so making sure that, you know, no matter what, that you guys manage your time more than anything, because that's literally, you know, think about, we can get all the money back in the world, you know, but we can't gain our time back, ever, so."

Brandon: "Yeah, that's, that's one of those things, Jerry, where I feel like it's a simple truth, it's not comp, I think a lot of us have heard that a lot, but like, I don't know, happenss for you, like sometimes it just sinks in, like way better than others, there's a lot of things that, that aren't difficult to understand, but they're difficult to feel, and like really, really understand, and that seems to be one that hit people a lot."

Jerry: "Yeah, yep, I agree with you on that, I think it's so important, and, you know, another thing, bringing into, just, you know, this is something I've struggled with in the past a lot, is like, comparison stuff, you know, and you just really have to watch that too, you just, the comparison thing will just eat you alive."

Brandon: "Yeah, you know, and so, you know, a lot of you might be listening to this, wherever you're at, you doing this acquisitioned yourself, that's okay, you know what I mean, and, and, guys, you don't have to have a team of a 100 people. I mean, you could be, you could have a team of four or five people, and do over a million a year in this business."

Jerry: "Yeah, I've seen it. Thank you, Jerry, that's, um, that's very impactful. You mentioned a few times that you were with students, that you, you know, have these different elements in your training. How does this work for anybody listening that might be interested?"

Brandon: "Well, guys, I, I own and operate what we call the REI Sales Academy, okay. It was

actually originally founded by John Martinez, which a lot of people know on that. I did buy his company several years ago. I think that the foundation that John created changed the whole real estate World investing world around, years ago, and then when I came involved, you know, I was able to bring over 3,000 deals done and completed to that side of things, and I think I've also so be able to bring the StreetWise typee of investing to that, so now I can take it and apply that with the sales process, Brandon, and I'm watching, I'm watching students do stuff that are just really amazing when it comes to this, so yeah, that's what we do, we have the REI sales Academy, Brandon, and we have people that come in all the time, just, guys, it's something that once you enter, it's a lifetime thing, you can add team members, and it's, you can, all their own on your team, you can have unlimited team members part of that, and, you know, so if that's something I can help you guys with, on things, I'm sure, Brandon, we can drop a link in here for him, on things, right?"

Brandon: "Yeah, yeah, sure, we can, we can throw a link in the, in the description."

Jerry: "Yeah, and use that, guys, because I'll, we'll make sure that, with Brandon, you guys will get an extra 10 percent off, on things, too."

Brandon: "Okay, cool, I didn't know they got that, that's pretty sweet, so yeah, we'll get that link together, we'll put it in the description here. I've heard awesome things about arios Academy, both before and after you."

Jerry: "Well, thank you, so I know there was a good foundation there, and I know that, I know, yeah, we train people every week on this, every single week, yeah, and it's, I've changed it up some, I do a 21, 21 week round now, which it goes for 21 weeks, and it resets, and what I, because John had a great model, but what I've added in, I've added in also actual listening to your actual sales calls, so now people can bring them in, I'll listen to them, we, and H, it's huge, we'll do live role playing, and then what I've done, so I, I've taken the training, and I've added in a coaching aspect to it, now too, so."

Brandon: "Sweet, and yeah, so it's really making a difference for a lot of students, so yeah."

Jerry: "Well, that's cool, Jerry, I'm looking forward to what we can do together too, we just, uh, started up some PC campaigns recently, and, and I expect you guys to rise to the top of our, of our list of best conver, well, dude, I mean, look, we've been going at it, what, just under a month, and I think we're already, already, I think Ashley told me right now, we're one and 12, on, on deals, on that, so."

Brandon: "Yeah, one and 12, that's good, especially for the time frame, because we're talking about bring leeks, right, so yeah, you still probably got another contract or two sitting in the leads you've already got, and that'll come in, you know, days, 60 days, 90 days, whatever the case is, because you know how it is, a lot of them are ready to go right away, but then there's plenty of that other on you just got to keep nurturing, on that side."

Jerry: "100 percent, so that's, that's good, so far, we'll, we'll get some, we'll get some more data to put your team to the test, and then when it's, when it's proven, I wantan to, I want to talk about what we did together because I think that'll be pretty cool."

Brandon: "All right, yeah, no, I'd love to, buddy."

Jerry: "Yeah, well, thank you, thank you for your time, Jerry, and, and for everybody else listening to this episode today, hope you got as much value from this as I did, and I'll see you next week."

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